X-Message-Number: 14664 Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 07:51:49 -0500 From: "www.IGGY.net - KC Homes" <> Subject: same or not same? References: <> >I was disappointed that no one in the recent flurry of > identity posts defended this very point of view! I for one > certainly argue that my duplicate and I are indeed the same > person, even if we are sitting across from one another > having a chat! Here's why: Same, by default, requires identical characteristics of an object, human being, etc. When two "same" people are sitting across from one another - they are not "same," as they are *across* from each other. Their characteristics are totally different (e.g. air pressure in their particular location is different though they may be 2 feet from each other, elevation of the chairs, magnetic & electric fields, gravitation, blood pressure, heart beats, blood cells count, their brain magnetic field, etc.). On top of that, these two individuals are digesting the other "same" person simultaneously and it's unpredictable at this point to figure how their mind will work. Therefore, they are not "same" but rather similar - how about this hair splitting? :-) Either way, the concept of "same" or close to "same" will involve cloning of humans and most likely creating of multiple copies of one individual to understand completely the processes governing brain development, social interactions, self image and perception of others. Will these people be the same? Just doesn't appear to make sense in light of the multiplicity of factors involved in raising an individual and don't forget a *chance" factor - something *will* come up that will change the set pattern of development. I'd be curious to look at this kind of a situation in about 10-20 years when human cloning will be a common practice and multiple clones of individuals are acting as full-fledged members of our society and civilization. Environment will shape them all different, even if they were brought up and raised in identical surroundings, with people saying same things to them, same tone of voice, them seeing same clothes on their "artificial parents", etc. - this is hardly unlikely to be a 100% clean experiment and probably will not accomplish the goal if there are laws protecting these clones. No doubt, as a general rule, that "clones" will enjoy same rights in the future as we all are and most likely will be protected under UN universal laws and most importantly other countries' internal laws. I can also foresee some other country or wealthy individual for that matter take matters into their own hands and just brush aside all the legal, ethical and moral issues and create a clone somewhere on a deserted island in the Pacific or on a research vessel in the middle of nowhere where the ever extending arm of law cannot reach. Then we all will be facing this fact "cold turkey" rather than having been intelligently prepared for it. These people may have all, any, or other things in mind doing that - a) purely scientific intention, b) want to create a profound change in the current religious and value belief systems of the mankind, c) have a demonic desire to control the world through an army of individuals raised to order, d) want to fulfill their own ambitions and satisfy their own deep inner desires (e.g. sexual, fetish, religious, giving to the world, acknowledgement by the humanity, etc), e) other intentions I have not even thought of. Wow, this world and this life is so beautiful! Now, I only need to figure out how to stop my next-door neighbor parking in front of my house instead of his and in his driveway! Any suggestions to this down-to--earth problem? :-) Sincerely, IGGY Dybal Your KANSAS CITY Real Estate Net-PRO ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ DOROTHY WAS RIGHT... "KANSAS CITY - THERE IS NO PLACE LIKE HOME" * Phone: (913) 894-4024 * Toll-free: (877) 550-IGGY/ 550-4449 * Fax: (913)894-4024 * E-mail: mailto: * Online Live Chat: http://www.iggy.net * ICQ# 73541286 * Web sites: http://www.iggy.net & http://www.Johnson-County-Homes.com * Broker Associate, RE/MAX Best Associates 11727 College Blvd., Overland Park, KS 66210 USA ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=14664