X-Message-Number: 16108 Date: Mon, 23 Apr 2001 16:05:20 +0000 () From: Louis Epstein <> Subject: Hello CryoNet I figure I might as well say hello to Cryonet. Not too long ago I read a lot of the archives.Not the whole thing,but enough to provide a sweeping over-the-years overview... seeing the various stages of people's affiliations and so forth. I see that the saga that began with Mike Federowicz,starry-eyed teen CSNY volunteer,as recounted by Steve Bridge when he was the Alcor Indiana rapporteur,has now entered yet another chapter (the last being when Mike Darwin,CCR researcher,said he saw little point in "freezing corpses" and despaired of cryonics as it then was).I've seen John Grigg go from his intro to the list as a politely-drooling Natasha Vita-More groupie,to the message where he invited me to join the list after I had provided him with the pertinent deathist Bible quote.(And I note that Natasha has found a voice,from the Nancie Clark posts in Keith Lynch's old archives that have almost no text). Some of you know me from the GRG mailing list(Damien Broderick, Max More,for example).John De Rivaz is on my own list of persons interested in supercentenarians...he put my list of known cases (which has since grown enormously) in Longevity Report 70. Keith Lynch knows me from alt.obituaries.I have had some side correspondence recently with Robert Ettinger and Olaf Henny. Looking at cryonics and people who are interested in it, it's easy to assume that it's strictly for atheists,bible-thumpers, extropians,homosexuals,posthumanists,"right-to-die" supporters, "right-to-life" supporters,singularitarians,transhumanists, vegetarians,and venturists.I am none of these things,to be clear. I'm just intrinsically hostile to dying.And even if I do die I do not want to rot. (I have yet to see a full explanation of how the much higher maintenance method of cryopreservation achieves better atomic fixation than the "modern mummification" of summum.org...clear out the alien-channeling nonsense and I think they still avoid the brain-destruction practice of the Egyptians.I am sure that such explanations can be offered). I am forty years old,and hope to see medicine that renders aging obsolete.I keep close watch on the extremes of proven longevity and look forward to seeing records shattered. (Here is something I have yet to be able to quite piece together with five notable lives,though with many,many sets of four available I present the closest approach...doing it with three is absolutely trivial. Adam Petty,Winston Cup top rookie and stock car dynast, was killed in a crash last year.He was born *the month before* Dorothy Stratten was murdered. Dorothy Stratten,onetime Playmate of the Year,maturing into an actress and Bogdanovich protegee,was murdered in 1980.She was born in 1960. King Faisal II of Iraq was assassinated in a coup d'etat in 1958.He was born in 1935. Clyde Barrow,gangster,was killed in a shootout in 1934 (along with the slightly younger Bonnie Parker).He was born in 1909. Luis Filipe,Crown Prince of Portugal,was assassinated in the streets of Lisbon in 1908.He was born in 1887. Marie Marthe Augustine (Mesange) Bremont was born the year before Crown Prince Luis Filipe.She celebrates her 115th birthday Wednesday. ALL these people have come and gone,one after another,in her life.) I celebrate endurance in the midst of surrounding change...not change itself,which can sometimes be useful but should be viewed with caution.I regard the highest obligation of a species as seeing to it that it is never replaced...which places me in opposition to the Yudkowskian-Posthumanist paradigm.Of course, I can only disprove "posthumanism" by successfully surviving all would-be "posthumans" without having to become one. I regard neuropreservation as a bad joke...if I sign up for cryonics it would be whole body.This ties in,I suppose,to my views on identity...that there can not be a "former me". Nor would I use a teleportation device that failed to beam the exact atoms disassembled for reassembly.As for an "artificial intelligence",if it thought the way I did it would have to share my views that an AI could not be me,and if it did not share my views it would not be an accurate representation of me and it therefore could not be me.Continuity is the keystone,whatever evolutions there can be no clean breaks. Well,I'll sit back and await the welcomes and flamewars and things in between Wednesday morning. Louis Epstein Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=16108