X-Message-Number: 16444
Date: Wed, 06 Jun 2001 07:25:07 -0400
From: Deathist Lurker Girl <>
Subject: On being taken seriously...

At 05:00 AM 06/06/2001, David Pizer wrote:
>(in CryoNet - Wed 6 Jun 2001)
>The very first thing to be done for one who wants to be a part of this
>unique project is to get personally signed up, at this time.  Only then,
>should you go out and try to help others.  You should not be taken
>seriously as a supporter of biological immortality, if you are not at least
>signed up for cryonics suspension.  I would also think it was acting
>irresponsibly if someone was advocating biological immortality and was not,
>at the very least, signed up for suspension, since often actions are
>counted more than words.

Okay, in the several months that have gone by since I first "delurked," 
many people have taken offense at many things said on this list.  Now it's 
my turn to grasp the holy mantle of umbrage...

There are a lot of people here- intelligent, brave, and innovative people- 
whom I greatly admire.  Some, I've even secretly crushed on from time to 
time ( waving shyly at David Pascal ) ;-)

But this above-quoted statement by Mr. Pizer typifies the elitist attitude 
that permeates much of this list.  Many cryonicists seem to think that if 
you don't fit *their* narrow version of what an immortalist is, you can't 
be an immortalist.  Just as No True Scotsman puts Equal  on his morning 
oatmeal, No True Immortalist isn't currently, personally, signed up to be 

Well, bullfeathers!

I am an avid reader of this list.  I am in favor of 
humanity/transhumanity/whatever-each-person's-own-term-is finding a way to 
be happily and productively immortal.  However, for personal reasons of my 
own, *I* do not choose to participate in this future *myself*

So that means I can't be taken seriously?

I am also a member of PFLAG, even though I am a straight, married 
female.  I send them money.  I participate in local Pride events and use my 
role as a health care worker/provider/educator, when appropriate, to dispel 
myths about homosexuality.

Using Mr. Pizer's logic, in order to be "taken seriously" I'd better get 
myself to a lesbian bar, pick out a cute girl, and spend the night with her 
so I can validate myself in the eyes of the glbt community.  Luckily for me 
(and for them), the queer people I know don't think that way.

As a result of my first post, I got a bit of a verbal backhand from Kennita 
Watson, after doing nothing more than saying that she was among those I 
admired.  Since then I have had the following warped scenario in my head 
(forgive me in advance for sharing it):

<cue Celine Dion...>

(Scene:  Kennita Watson and I on the slippery deck of the rapidly-sinking 
Titanic, surrounded by multitudes of frantic, pushing, shoving people 
attempting to squeeze into the few remaining lifeboats.)

Man's voice:  "We can take one more in this boat!  Only one more!  Hurry!"

DLG: "You go, Kennita.  You're young and courageous.  You *want* to live."

Kennita:  "What are you talking about?  *You* have to go, too!"

DLG: "You heard the man.  There's only room for one more.  And all the 
other boats are filled up too.  It's okay.  I've lived a good life and I'm 
at peace with my decision.  I'll die happy, knowing you'll survive..."

Man's voice: "Oh fer chrissakes, will you quit with the sap and figure out 
which one of you is getting on here?  And someone squelch that wailing 
Canadian broad before I lose my lunch!"

<cut Celine Dion>

DLG (grasping Kennita's hand and gazing meaningfully into her eyes):  "Go 
now.  And please...remember me..."

Kennita (freeing her hand, lowering her eyes and getting into the crowded 
lifeboat): "Sure, yeah... I'll remember *for about five minutes* that you 
were some random dumbass who refused to get into this lifeboat..."

Man's voice: "It's about time... let's get out of here before that song 
starts up again!  I don't think I could take any more of that..."

(big boat sinks, people in lifeboats are rescued, Celine sings some more 
<shudder>, y'all know the rest)...

So this is the kind of thing I'm facing here.  Goshdarnit, despite the fact 
that you people think you're the s***  (I guess ego is a co-requisite to 
most kinds of major achievement), you fight like cats and dogs over 
*everything*, and most of you'd probably reject me out of hand just because 
I'm not (in the most complete sense) "one of you," I'm trying to help you.


I'm trying to educate myself about cryonics, transhumanism, and all the 
varying denominations thereof.  As a health care professional, I believe I 
can provide positive input if/when the situation arises where a terminally 
ill person in my care has plans to be suspended and no one else around 
knows Jack Diddley about cryonics.  I know several people who are on my 
hospital's Ethics Committee and am in a position to advise them, if 
necessary.  I also think I'm in a good position to provide a valuable 
"outsider's view" on various issues regarding the futurist/immortalist 
image as perceived by the general public.  When I get in a more solvent 
financial position, I would even consider contributing financially to your 
cause(s).  But hey, it sounds more and more like you don't want me to.

I do love this list, and many of the people; but the insults are beginning 
to wear on me.  Perhaps I should seek warmer (pun fully intended) company...?


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