X-Message-Number: 17323
From: "George Smith" <>
References: <>
Subject: Survival versus self esteem
Date: Sun, 19 Aug 2001 14:15:44 -0700

If we assign value to the self then there are many prices to be paid.  One
of these is the anxiety of that value possibly dropping.

Another is the tendency toward suicide (in all its varied forms) when it
does drop.

Another is the opening of the door that implies that in order for something
(or someone) to BE, there must be "justification", a "reason" and that
everything and everyone must be also first assigned a value in order to
exist.

This leads commonly toward the creation (or assumption of the existence of)
a supreme Judge, an objective (external, "not you") God Who decides whether
or not you have sufficient value to continue to earn the right to BE.

As Louis Epstein wrote just yesterday in the Cryonet:

"A universe in which there are no
overarching objective standards
more important than anyone's opinion
is a universe in which nothing has
any real value,and in which there
is no good reason to exist."

Yes.  That's right.  What is, simply is.  What IS does not need a REASON to
exist.  It is ALREADY there.

When we make the assumption that in order for things to BE they must FIRST
have a justification, a value, then the rest follows easily and we enter
into theological debates regarding the nature of such a universe.

(Also this is pretty crazy when you think about it.  Like holding a
meteorite and saying that it cannot exist since rocks do not fall from the
sky like this one did.  Yet there the damned thing is as real as all get
out!  The rock just doesn't care that we might believe it has to jump
through our verbal hoops in order to justify it existing before it can do
so.  The rock is simply THERE and refuses to pop out of existence due to its
embarrassment over existing without permission,).

But my cat does NOT first make an evaluation on ANY level regarding his
ongoing desire to keep breathing, eating, sleeping, etc.  When we slice away
all the verbage, our desires for various pleasures (intellectual also!) as
well as our efforts to avoid pain are fundamental and already present.
(Manipulating these in the future will be great fun also - fun is
pleasurable).

What we say in words ABOUT these primaries is just that - descriptions.

Only we human beings have devised language to dissassociate ourselves from
the simple fact that we exist, and instead pretend we have to first achieve
something to "justify" (measure up) our existence or continued existence.
We talk about our "self" as if it were separate and therefore just another
object int he universe to be evaluated for its usefullness.  We confuse the
tool USER with another TOOL.

To skip this erroneous mental step wipes away the existential anxiety of
existence in every area of life from which this unnecessary step is removed.
To include this step leads us into a hall of mirrors in which we must
"justify" out existence rather than simply admit to it.

"Here I am.  Prove that I ain't!" - Refrain from my infamous unpublished rap
lyrics.

The urge toward life extension, of which cryonics is a vital part in my
opinion, does not require an effort to achieve.

It's ABSENCE is dependent upon first assuming we have to somehow EARN the
right to HAVE the nature we already do (seeking pleasure and avoiding pain).
That in a nutshell is why I believe that those of us who have committed to
cryonics find the arguments of those who reject it so incredibly vacuous.

Yet, in essence, the rejection of cryonics seems to almost always stem from
the premise that the self should not have such value as to reach for
physical immortality.  Then the Judge of that lack of self value will
surface as "God", "the greater good", or more amorphous issues dependent
upon social peer pressure summarized by the common parental statement of
"Just who do you think you are!"

When you look through the tinted sunglasses of self evaluation as a primary,
it looks as though it is everywhere.  When you remove those sunglasses you
discover that the world exists entirely without this word invented
perspective.  The whole of the animal kingdom offers mute testimony to all
motivation stemming from our nature as living beings who seek pleasure and
avoid pain.  For some the zoo is an embarrassment while for others it is an
enlightenment.

A common concern is that to live without self-justification would result in
lethargy or destruction.  The contrary is clearly the case.  Constantly
needing to place a price tag on the soul leads to existential anxiety and
slavery to judgemental religious perspectives in which hell gapes below the
squirming worm of the individual man in that "All have sinned and fallen
short of the glory of God".

The nature of the self is still quite mysterious.  To probe it's spacial
position and qualities seems to lead into strange even mystical dimensions
as well as into the possibility that it is nothing more than a verbally
generated illusion.  The personal EXPERIENCE of life, however, can be
greatly enhanced by dropping the choice for self judgement (self esteem,
self worth, etc.) and instead accepting the REALITY of "Here you are" but
separating it from the rather delusional need for adding "but is it OKAY for
you to be here?"

Mike Perry sees things ethically very much as I do.  (He also likes cats!)
I would submit that this is probably NOT due to the inclusion of self worth
but very much in spite of it.  The drives which cause human beings (and
other living things) to seek survival derive not from an evaluation of self,
but from evaluations of the ENVIRONMENT.  Seeking pleasure and avoiding pain
is the given.  I see the accuracy of our evaluations of the the world AROUND
us as critical in our efforts to maintain life.  I am 100% FOR evaluating
and placing a value on OTHERS and the WORLD in general.

So is my cat.

In essence my cat is so far removed from the possiblity of entertaining a
need to ascribe a value to himself that he seems beyond all possible limits
of (human) arrogance.  He IS his own God except that even that concept would
be somewhat limiting in our efforts to describe his perspective.  He simply
IS.  He would never entertain the idea that there would be any possible way
to evaluate that primary fact.  He would not, as his own God, ever consider
judging himself.

That is part of the reason I like cats.  They serve as reminders to me of
the truth of things.

The problem is in being able to shake free of the almost universal
ASSUMPTION of self esteem as a given.  The fact that at any moment anyone
who is engaging in this verbal activity can drop it and see if things are
then better, is a fascinating and ever present possibility.  I have found
with amazing consistency that EVERY TIME someone drops the need for "self
evaluation" in favor of "other evaluation", the quality of their lives
improves.

I have NOT found even ONE instance in which the opposite is true.

I find that amazing but not surprising.

The difference is between viewing the universe as a judgmental game in which
you are constantly being evaluated (by God, some other external perspective,
or even your own mind) on how well or poorly you are doing, as opposed to
viewing the universe as a toolbox you can use to try to get what you want
(and avoid what you don't want).

I hope this better explains what I have been talking about and how it
relates to cryonics and personal survival versus self evaluation (self
esteem, self worth, etc.), which I view as a dangerous and destructive
social trap and the true source of the "Deathist" perspective in our world.

George Smith
CI member

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