X-Message-Number: 1865 Subject: CRYONICS Desire to survive Date: Tue, 02 Mar 93 10:20:29 EST From: The entity calling itself Clarissa Wells states or at least hints at several conclusions about the cryonics community (this is not intended to be a complete list): 1. We don't cooperate enough because we are too concerned about personal survival and lack concern for the group as a whole. 2. Deciding to expell a suspension member is not a practical way to defend against the actions of that member. 3. Deciding to expell a suspension member is unjust, unethical, unscrupulous, and evidence of lack of reverence of life in general. I agree with the conclusion of 1 but not the reasoning. The problem is compulsive shortsighted behavior. Concerns about long-term survival, if pursued rationally, would lead to more cooperation. I think I agree with 2, although my opinion doesn't seem very reliable or relevant because I wasn't there. 3 is clearly wrong. Have a look at Axelrod's "Evolution of Cooperation". Unconditional cooperation promotes the growth of parasites, so any reasonable notion of "reverence for life in general" isn't going to require unconditional preservation of all life. Life is not something that you measure by counting people or by weighing the total amount of living protoplasm. Living things are special because they manifest behavior and pursue goals. The reverent way to deal with living things is to promote linkage between the behavior and the goals, which may mean making the goals unachievable when the behavior is inappropriate. Playing a version of tit-for-tat that is suitably adapted to the real world is correct behavior whether you are concerned with your personal survival or the well being of the system as a whole. At this point I tend to agree with those who think that Clarissa Wells is a false front. Are there any real people out there who agree with her, or am I preaching only to the converted and the nonexistent? Tim Freeman <> When they took the fourth amendment, I was silent because I don't deal drugs. When they took the sixth amendment, I kept quiet because I know I'm innocent. When they took the second amendment, I said nothing because I don't own a gun. Now they've come for the first amendment, and I can't say anything at all. Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=1865