X-Message-Number: 20882
Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 23:11:41 -0700
From: Mike Perry <>
Subject: Re: Information in the Universe

Francois, #20871:

>I have read about a speculation in physics that once information is created,
>it can never be destroyed.

As I understand it, recovery of this information, while it's supposed to be 
possible in principle, would require trapping all the photons that result 
from the information-creating process. If some of these photons get away 
(very easy), there's no getting them back, barring faster-than-light travel 
(or some other strange possibility such as the eventual, controlled 
collapse of the universe to bring the fugitives home again). Some also 
argue that black holes effectively crunch any information from anything 
falling into them, while I've seen arguments that maybe this isn't so either.

>Still, it could mean that permanent death is ABSOLUTELY
>impossible in our universe. A sufficiently advanced technology would always
>be able to recover all the information defining us as individuals and use it
>to perfectly recreate those individuals, even after an arbitrarly long time.
>It would also make cryonics a moot point.

You could, of course, recreate replicas of vanished individuals even in the 
absence of information about them, if you want to make enough guesses 
("throws of the dice"). If we have eternity and effectively infinite space 
(through expansion of the universe, say), this outcome could be inevitable, 
even if no one is trying at all. (Random processes go on, and additional 
chances could be offered by parallel universes.) So the immortality of all 
could be guaranteed by physics. But physics won't guarantee a pleasant or 
convenient path thereto. Some, of course, are not happy with and reject the 
idea of survival through a replica, but a case can be made to the contrary. 
I do so in my book, *Forever for All*, but also include a chapter defending 
cryonics as a preferred choice. You clearly have more control over what is 
going on. By way of analogy, I would prefer not to be cryopreserved at all 
and just have aging and terminal diseases eliminated. Failing this, my 
second choice is cryonics. If cryonics fails, well, I can hope for eventual 
recreation as a replica, or some such possibility. There are many, of 
course--those now deceased and not preserved--for which the latter is the 
only hope--barring the supernatural or other such mechanism. Those still 
living have more options. I definitely prefer what seems the most 
conservative of available choices, again, cryonics over destructive 
processes such as burial or cremation. (Is there a good reason to feel 
otherwise?)

Mike Perry

Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=20882