X-Message-Number: 2346
Date: 15 Jul 93 07:11:27 EDT
From: Mike Darwin <>
Subject: CRYONICS Reply to Tanya's CRYOMSG #2344

From: Mike Darwin
To: All
Date: 14 July, 1993
Re: Response to Tanya Jones msg #2344

    1)   I have spoken with both Steve Bridge and Hugh Hixon about  by  my 
invitation  to  come  and discuss the suspension.  I  recall  having  this 
conversation  with  Steve Bridge...or perhaps Hugh.  However,  neither  of 
them  recall  it.   I  do NOT think they are lying.   I  know  I  am  not.  
Therefore,   I   will  (personally)  chalk  this  up  to  a   failure   of 
communication.   Steve  B.  has told me that he feels there  was  no  slur 
intended.  I never said I spoke with Tanya about this.  My apologies if  I 
am the one at fault here.  And by the way the invitation still stands.   

     2)  My perspective about the response to cardiac arrest came from  my 
conversations  with Steve Bridge.  I spoke with Steve Bridge this  evening 
and  he  confirmed that my comments re his  comments  are  representative.  
Steve  then went on to say that he (Steve) and Tanya have "something of  a 
difference of opinion" about how things went during initial (post  cardiac 
arrest  stabilization of the patient).  Tanya is entitled to her  opinion.  
All  I  am  saying is that the person who was there who has  also  been  a 
trained EMT differs.

     3)   I asked Hugh Hixon if he was able to do blood gases and he  said 
no.  Since we had previously discussed the problems with the gas  machine, 
I  assumed  that  was  the reason why.  If  that  is  incorrect,  I  stand 
corrected.  I suggest you get a user friendly blood gas machine.
    
     4)  I stand by my remarks that extracorporeal circulation should  not 
start  (even  on test basis) without the tubing anchored.  I  have  spoken 
with my perfusionist on this and he concurs.

     5)  I was told that there was substantial loss of circulating  volume 
by  two individuals.  If this not correct, I stand corrected.  What  would 
help  here would be to know a) what was the recircultating volume, and  b) 
how much was lost.

     6) Tanya is incorrect if she thinks I am advocating Harvey  Cushing's 
alleged  treatment of residents or that I treat those I work with in  that 
manner.  This was NOT what I said.  However, having said that, I would  be 
the  first to say that if everything negative said about Cushing is  true, 
it  would   still be worth it.  The man basically  INVENTED  neurosurgery.  
Also, with regard to Cushing, as I have learned from wide reading and hard 
personal  experience anyone who does anything of importance is  ultimately 
found  out (by someone) to an ogre who beat his wife (or  his  residents).  
There  are several reasons for this:  1) People who achieve a  great  deal 
usually  do  so  because they are convinced they  are  RIGHT.   Churchill, 
Cushing,   Alexis   Carrel,  Michael  DeBakey,   Alexander   of   Macedon, 
Michaelangelo....these  were not timid souls or one of the gang type  guys 
who were low stress personalities.  Maybe they would have gotten MORE done 
had they been.  But I for one doubt it.  Since I didn't have to work  with 
them,  I can be very philosophical and sanguine about these  matters.   2) 
Envy.   While  I  am  not  in  this  class  of  individual  I  have   some 
understanding of what they went through.  3)  Historical revisionism: look 
at what happened to Christopher Columbus.

      The part of the quote left out of from Spetzler was for brevity.  In 
hindsight I can see where this was not a good idea, but there were no evil 
intentions.  

     7)  If  Tanya looked at the training materials Jerry  assembled  then 
there  is, in my opinion, even less excuse for her to have tried  to  pass 
them off as protocols.  I erred in saying that the manuals were removed in 
June.   Paul (who removed them) has corrected me on this and  pointed  out 
that they were among the last items removed by him and were removed  circa 
November, or approximately 12 months after I left.  While 11 months  ain't 
a year, hopefully we can all agree that it is close enough.  I stand by my 
(and Paul's) assessment about the contents of these manuals.

     8)   Tanya  is  correct that she was not given  material  related  to 
appropriate pH.  Since I did not handle this exchange directly, all I  can 
do  is ask Paul Wakfer to comment:

Comment by Paul Wakfer: Please see my comment in CRYONICS.POLITICS.

     9)   Some  general comments:  I have been very clear that  I  do  not 
advocate  paralyzing  emotionalism  or  vitriolic  backbiting  in  solving 
problems  like  this.   I do, however, think they should  be  solved,  and 
thoroughly investigated by an outside agency.

     I took the time to catalogue the problems with this suspension not to 
try  to  be "mean", but specifically in response to assertions  by  Tanya, 
Dave Pizer (off the net) and others that this suspension went better  than 
those  since  Jerry went down.  I do not believe that was the case  and  I 
wished  to  point  out that there were problems, some  of  them  the  same 
problems  that  have  occurred  before.  I too  resent  slurs  (direct  or 
indirect) on my performance particularly when they are not accurate.

     I  would  like to thank Tanya for taking the time to  respond  to  my 
comments and to provide the information she has.

     Finally,  the point I have been trying to make from the start is  the 
issue of *what happended to this patient*.
   

















Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=2346