X-Message-Number: 26613
Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2005 08:39:28 -0400
From: Thomas Donaldson <>
Subject: RBR's belief in souls

Hello everyone!

Reading RBR's messages it sounds very much as if he believes that we have
souls. He seems to consider this constantly in his replies. His version of
a soul does not envision the normal case in which the soul survived its
physical expression, but it's still a soul. He argues against various
ways to preserve us in terms of whether or not our soul continues, not
just an identical version of our brain.

The critical idea which convinces me that he believes in a soul is that
a direct and exact copy of a human brain, when revived, does not bring
the same soul with it. (Whether the copy also makes a different soul
for the copy is a question he doesn't answer, but then if the soul is
different the copy is a different person).

The notion of soul, of course, comes from religion, and in terms of
stating how we work, it comes from old ideas of Descartes, who thought
that our souls connected to our brains through our pituitary glands.
Still, perhaps because of its religious origin, RBR may find it hard
to understand how we work, remember, and are conscious WITHOUT a
soul. 

1. If he has this religious belief in a soul, then no rational argument
   will convince him otherwise, and anyone trying to do so is wasting
   their time.

2. I myself, and it looks like many others on Cryonet, do not believe
   that we have souls, and therefore have no metaphysical or 
   philosophical problem with the possibility of making copies of 
   ourselves.

   I will add, speaking for myself, that even without metaphysical,
   philosophical, or even scientific problems with a copy of myself,
   copies will inevitably make lots of very practical problems: who
   now owns the house, the car, the computers, the credit and membership
   cards, the books, and so on and on. I and my copy, remember, will
   have the same memories, which means that we BOTH think that all 
   of those possessions, plus any intangible awards or jobs, should
   go to ME rather than the copy. 

   It's one thing to make a copy of me after the original me has
   become impossible to fix or revive, and quite another to make a
   copy of me while I remain alive. The first case is fine, the 
   second causes a disaster.

AS for RBR, it may be best to let him sort out his belief in a soul
for himself.

              Best wishes and long long life for all,

                   Thomas Donaldson

PS: And yes, I include RBR in my "Best wishes etc" end to this message.

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