X-Message-Number: 26783 Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2005 09:18:38 -0400 From: Thomas Donaldson <> Subject: death, suicide, & reasons for suicide Hi Everyone, cryonauts and cryoneers: Yes, I am Thomas Donaldson. I will start by adding a little to what Ettinger said: we began the suit to allow suspension before legal death while I wasn't near dying because lawsuits take a long time. If it had been started AFTER I was terminal, the legal suit will have continued with no answer until I had died and it had become meaningless. That's why we started it before I was dying. There isn't any other alternative. As to suicide so that you can be suspended, that remains an important question for anyone with a disease affecting their brain. Not just brain tumors, but Alzheimer's and other such conditions can kill you months or even years before most doctors will declare you legally dead. I use the word "kill" here quite literally: if your brain is destroyed by any disease you have died, whether or not the law and medicine of today consider that you have died. The problem gets even worse if you're surrounded by people with primitive notions of life, like the woman who was supported by her hospital until her husband finally got them to withdraw support. Her brain, when examined afterwards, had largely disappeared for her cortex, and her breathing and heartbeat continued because they're produced by very low brain centers. By the way, if I understand rightly, this woman had suffered serious brain injury due to an accident: one more event which can kill you even if current medicine and law still claim you're still alive. When Alcor launched the lawsuit there was also lots of discussion about just what kinds of suicide would avoid legal delays and autopsy. The best form of suicide for cryonics purposes turned out to be starvation: stop eating anything, and if you feel like drinking something drink only water. Apparently after a few days the feeling of hunger disappears. The major advantage of starvation for suspension is simply that no one can claim that you were murdered or produce any reason for an autopsy. This was the main reason it was proposed. Precisely because I was not (yet?) dying, I haven't tried starvation as a form of suicide. My tumor recurred several years ago and I'm taking a drug against it. So far I haven't had any bad reactions to the drug, and the tumor has shrunk but still not gone away. So I may yet need to try suicide by starvation. Naturally I'd hope to get back to Scottsdale before I do this, but I don't really know what will happen. After all, if you haven't noticed you should: staying alive can be tough, and the Universe acts as if it wants to kill you. Best wishes and long long life for all, Thomas Donaldson Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=26783