X-Message-Number: 27465
From: 
Subject: Re:Life Extension with Zinc/Copper [Doug Skrecky]
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2006 02:32:53 US/Eastern

> X-Message-Number: 27456
> Date: Mon, 02 Jan 2006 17:25:54 +0000
> From: Riso <>
> Subject: Re:Life Extension with Zinc/Copper [Doug Skrecky]
>
> Doug Skrecky wrote:
>
> >Message #27455
> >Date: Sun, 1 Jan 2006 16:14:32 -0800 (PST)
> > Subject: Life Extension with Zinc/Copper
> >
> >                Life Extension With Zinc/Copper
> >                       By Doug Skrecky
> 
> Hi Doug, this is interesting. I have some questions:
>
> skip
> 
> >    In the Age-Related Eye Disease Study (AREDS) 4753 healthy persons aged
> >  55 to 81 years were followed for a median of 6.5 years. Of these 534
> >  (11%) died. Some subjects recieved a zinc/copper supplement, some
> >  recieved an antioxidant supplement instead, while yet others recieved
> >  both types of supplement. The zinc/copper supplement consisted of 80 mg
> >  zinc as zinc oxide, and 2 mg of copper as cupric oxide. The antioxidant
> >  supplement consisted of 500 mg vitamin C, 400 IU vitamin E, and 15 mg
> >  beta carotene. All-cause mortality was increased by 15% by the
> >  antioxidant supplement, decreased 28% by zinc/copper, and decreased by
> >  14% by their combination. Thus antioxidants appeared to exert a harmful
> >  effect on survival, while zinc/copper offered a more powerful beneficial
> >  effect.
>
> Do you have any idea why the antioxidant supplement 
> *increased*  mortality?.  I know correlation does not mean causation and 
> that as the author says further studies are needed, but I am intrigued.
> 
> I wonder if the problem is with beta carotene as I remember a study in 
> which taking a supplement of vitamin C and E correlated with decreased risk 
> of Alzheimer s: "Reduced Risk of Alzheimer Disease in Users of  Antioxidant 
> Vitamin Supplements" (Arch Neurol. 2004;61:82-88), so I think vitamin C and 
> E should not be a problem.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Riso  

  I think Douglas Skrecky puts too much faith in epidemiological studies. There
is such a thing as a good epidemiological study, but a huge proportion of them
are misinformation. The bad epidemiologists fail to consider all of the human
variables and lack understanding of the underlying molecular biology. I prefer
animal studies, cell culture studies and molecular biology as a means to 
understand supplements that may be of benefit in life extension. 


  Zinc/copper plus Vitamin C, Vitamin E and beta-carotene? What can be expected?
  Vitamin C is an effective anti-oxidant except in the presence of certain
metal ions. Vitamin C can reduce ferric ion to ferrous ion, thereby promoting
the Fenton reaction -- *if* the dosages of Vitamin C are not large. Vitamin C
reduces copper 80 times more efficiently than it reduces iron. Normally these
metals are tightly bound to carrier proteins, but tobacco smoke and pollutants
can dislodge the metals. 

  Beta-carotene is an effective singlet oxygen quencher, but a notorious large
scale study in 1996 indicated that beta-carotene *increases* lung cancer rates
in smokers -- and the effect is the worst with those who smoke and drink
heavily. Animal studies suggest that alcohol causes the formation of abnormal
carotenoids in the liver, leading to destruction of Vitamin A and exacerbation
of lung cell proliferation. Vitamin E epidemiology studies almost invariably 
use alpha-tocopherol, which lowers tissue levels of delta-tocopherol (the
form of Vitamin E most commonly found in diet). Nitrogen dioxide in tobacco
smoke reacts with alpha-tocopherol to form mutagenic compounds, whereas
gamma-tocopherol has the capacity to detoxify nitrogenous compounds. 

  These matters are all discussed in great detail on my website:

    http://www.benbest.com/nutrceut/AntiOxidants.html

    http://www.benbest.com/nutrceut/VitaminE.html
   
    -- Ben
Best

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