X-Message-Number: 27902
From: "Hare, Tim R" <>
Subject: RE: [CN] Maximizing the health of the aging brain
Date: Wed, 3 May 2006 11:36:07 -0400

Dear David, 

I'm at a loss at to how to account for the email you post below...it appears
to be a composite of some sort?  The original email response to John de
Rivaz, which contains my un-edited response, is posted below for reference:
The second half of the "quote" below, seems to be have pasted in and
ascribed to me. 

Cheers, T-

> As noted, we'll be comparing three products (at minimum) noted in the
> original full email, and the inexpensive web-based offerings
> (www.mybraintrainer.com) are likely to offer some cognitive gains,  
> I would
> think, based upon the literature in this area.

http://www.mybraintrainer.com/press/study.asp

> IQ testing was conducted using the Virtual Knowledge computer  
> program. The treatment group demonstrated a 9 point increase in IQ  
> as compared to a 1 point increase for the control group, a  
> statistically significant result.



"However I am sure that we on CryoNet will all be interested in how Mr and
Mrs Hare get on with using the product, and whether they consider their
money well spent. The cost, although very high for a piece of domestic or
gaming software, is comparable with buying vitamins on a regular basis, for
example."

I'll keep you posted.  

As noted, we'll be comparing three products (at minimum) noted in the
original full email, and the inexpensive web-based offerings
(www.mybraintrainer.com) are likely to offer some cognitive gains, I would
think, based upon the literature in this area.  

As well, if one already has a Nintendo-DS (or if one can *coax it away* from
the kidling) the cost for the Brainage software is only ca. $40 and it's
likely to be as stimulating at the web-based service above, if not more so,
in net, since it's mobile and can be used more often as a consequence,
depending on lifestyle.  I enjoy it and find it addictive.  In fact, I seem
to recall some indication that the sort of video games we all played as
youngsters (Atari, or arcade) may be good for us now, and you can buy these
for as little as $10 for a complete bundle packet of all our old arcade
favorites....a sweat deal, in my view.  However, the Brainage is unique in
that it sets up ongoing "cognitive dissonance", which offers the promise of
lack of quick entrainment on the part of the user, and so ongoing cognitive
effort.   

A final comment: the customer service numbers on the
http://www.positscience.com receipt(should you choose to buy) are wrong (!),
and you should call 800-514-3975 with any questions.  Also, the email
address one should use is [], not the one in
the receipt...not working, but they are testing.  As well, one *might* get
the impression that there is a continuing fee for access (full activation)
of the software (this from the literature that comes with it, in my opinion)
-- there is *not*, I was just told.  So, it's a one-time fee for unlimited
use of whatever is included.  I used it last night for the first time, and
it was fun, but too little info gleaned as yet to assess it's likely worth,
so I'll update again in ca. 40 sessions (about 1.5 months).  Feel free to
drop me a line at my email below if you want an update before then.  

Cheers! T-

Timothy R. Hare 
Automated Biotechnology (952) 
Bld NW-2, 503 Louise Lane, North Wales, PA 19454 
Merck E-mail: <mailto:> 
Voice: (267) 305-3235
Mobile (267) 984-7136
FAX: (267) 305-0182 



-----Original Message-----
From: CryoNet F [mailto:] On Behalf Of John de Rivaz
Sent: Sunday, April 30, 2006 7:28 AM
To: CryoNet F
Subject: Re: [CN] Maximizing the health of the aging brain


I took a look at
http://www.positscience.com/programs/buy.php
and would suggest that anyone interested read this page first and decide
whether to spend any more time on the rest of their web site
http://www.positscience.com
A good idea of the product's nature can be obtained from
http://www.positscience.com/programs/tour.php . I thought that the video
that is also available on the site is very much sales orientated and less
informative.

Note that this program costs more than many PCs on which it may run. It will
not run on older PCs, and also if more than one person uses it, higher
prices have to be paid. I suspect that this is built into the program
because it needs to record each user's progress as difficulty levels
increase, and you can't just illegally ignore the terms and conditions. On
the plus side, there are lots of extras in the pack, such as stereo
headphones, a DVD and so on. As the system is based on listening, it may be
important that the sound is accurate, but then this also depends on the
audio side of the PC, not just the headphones.

It is also a pity that there is no downloadable version (that I could see)
as this avoids high postage charges and import taxes for foreign buyers.
Companies that respect customers' money often offer downloadable versions of
their software as buying this way can make an appreciable difference to the
total outlay. This is because postage, taxes and associated compliance fees
can nearly double the cost in some instances of physical delivery.

I would suspect that over the coming year many more similar products will
appear and by this time next year there will be a much wider choice of
products at varying price levels and with different ranges of luxury
accessories. This looks to be a high volume market and a type of application
that most people will hear about. This type of product should certainly sell
in the sort of volume as popular computer games and will appear in versions
for dedicated games machines.   As usual, early adopters will pay a lot more
than average. I suspect that Positscience have set up a well organised and
structured business, maybe with a view to a stock market floatation in the
future. Thus they have a lot of professional fees to recover before they
start to earn profits.

However I am sure that we on CryoNet will all be interested in how Mr and
Mrs Hare get on with using the product, and whether they consider their
money well spent. The cost, although very high for a piece of domestic or
gaming software, is comparable with buying vitamins on a regular basis, for
example.

-- 
Sincerely, John de Rivaz:  http://John.deRivaz.com for websites including
Cryonics Europe, Longevity Report, The Venturists, Porthtowan, Alec Harley
Reeves - inventor, Arthur Bowker - potter, de Rivaz genealogy,  Nomad .. and
more

> Subject: FW: [CR] Maximizing the health of the aging brain
> Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2006 15:53:40 -0400
>
> My wife and I have purchased the Positscience product and I'll report back
> on that at some stage,

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--
Notice:  This e-mail message, together with any attachments, contains
information of Merck & Co., Inc. (One Merck Drive, Whitehouse Station, New
Jersey, USA 08889), and/or its affiliates (which may be known outside the
United States as Merck Frosst, Merck Sharp & Dohme or MSD and in Japan, as
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Timothy R. Hare 
Automated Biotechnology (952) 
Bld NW-2, 503 Louise Lane, North Wales, PA 19454 
Merck E-mail: <mailto:> 
Voice: (267) 305-3235
Mobile (267) 984-7136
FAX: (267) 305-0182 



-----Original Message-----
From: CryoNet F [mailto:] On Behalf Of David Stodolsky
Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2006 8:05 AM
To: CryoNet F
Subject: Re: [CN] Maximizing the health of the aging brain


On 1 May 2006, at 23:38, Hare, Tim R wrote:

> As noted, we'll be comparing three products (at minimum) noted in the
> original full email, and the inexpensive web-based offerings
> (www.mybraintrainer.com) are likely to offer some cognitive gains,  
> I would
> think, based upon the literature in this area.

http://www.mybraintrainer.com/press/study.asp

> IQ testing was conducted using the Virtual Knowledge computer  
> program. The treatment group demonstrated a 9 point increase in IQ  
> as compared to a 1 point increase for the control group, a  
> statistically significant result.

The Virtual Knowledge computer program seems no longer to be  
available, since the site was shut down. Given that reproducibility  
is a key criterion for scientific investigation, these results should  
not be accepted as valid.


dss

David Stodolsky    Skype: davidstodolsky

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States as Merck Frosst, Merck Sharp & Dohme or MSD and in Japan, as Banyu) that
may be confidential, proprietary copyrighted and/or legally privileged. It is 
intended solely for the use of the individual or entity named on this message.  
If you are not the intended recipient, and have received this message in error, 
please notify us immediately by reply e-mail and then delete it from your 
system.

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