X-Message-Number: 30012
Date: Fri, 09 Nov 2007 14:12:38 -0700
From: Kitty Antonik Wakfer <>
Subject: Re: names not listed in Alcor membership directory
References: <>

> 
> Message #30007
> Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 23:47:47 -0800 (PST)
> From: un person <>
> Subject: re: names not listed in Alcor membership directory
> 
> Ah, Finance Dept...er....I mean, flavonoid, thanks for
> the very appropriate Pink Floyd lyrics there. The
> lunatic is on the grass, indeed....
> Pink Floyd and Led Zep forever, right, dude?
> 
> 
> And in that same vein, looking at my alcor membership
> directory, there are about 350 names in it. Alcor has
> over 700 members. So about half opted for making their
> membership public. And BTW, flav, there are almost as
> many members listed for New mexico as for New York
> state. Curious, no?
> 
> 
> I feel sorry for "philossifur" if he has indeed lost
> his Alcor membership. As his public posts have made
> clear over the years, his financial situation is not
> all that great. I question whether he could get
> another membership with alcor if he let this one
> lapse. But then there is always CI...if he still has
> his insurance policy. And being 50 years old, getting
> more insurance could be a problem.
> 
> 
> As for other names that are not there, NONE of the
> Extropians are listed in the book, except for one who
> now lives in Central AZ and has repudiated the
> extropian era.
> 
> Also missing from the listing are the names of the
> once very high profile extropian couple who now live
> in texas, one of whom was still active in cryonics
> until very recently. Was this just an oversight on
> their part, or have they parted ways with Alcor or
> cryonics itself? Or are they (and others) leery of
> having their names associated with cryonics? My real
> life name is fairly common, so it would be hard to
> google me up. I wonder if this list is googleable?
> 
> Which leads me back to another pet topic of mine.
> Cryonicists seem to get interested in cryonics and
> sign up at a certain stage of life, one in which they
> are afraid to die. I was frightened of death in the
> mid 90s when I signed up. I no longer am that
> frightened of death. I think my body has changed and
> as a consequence, I have lost much of my fear of
> death. I think this change is something that happens
> to maybe all people and to cryos of course. I think
> this change may have a genetic cause and have a
> beneficial societal effect with respect to improved
> survival of the species etc, and that it is an evolved
> characteristic of humans.
> 
> I still have my alcor membership and plan on being
> cryopreserved. I am in the Alcor listing. I want to
> live. I want to see the future. I want to live
> forever. But I have lost the urgency. I have lost my
> fear of death, or at least I have lost much of my fear
> of death.
> 
> I can see this same thing happening to other Cryos
> over the years. Or at least I suspect it is behind
> their actions. Paul Wakfer? 

Huh??.... Either you didn't read the Directory very thoroughly or you 
don't know that Paul is a legal Canadian resident and therefore listed 
under Ontario - with his full postal address, phone number and email 
address. (The same type listing is present for me - under Arizona.) Our 
names do not signify any support or endorsement of Alcor, but simply 
that we have cryopreservation contracts with Alcor, funded by variable 
annuities through Vanguard that designate Alcor the beneficiary.

As for being "frightened of death", Paul has never had this emotion. He 
has always been convinced and maintained to others that wanting to have 
an unlimited lifespan is not the same as being fearful of death. Perhaps 
you now understand that also. One may be "fearful"  - if someone insists 
on using that word - of severe deterioration and loss of function of 
one's body, but we take significant life extension measures and have 
seen only insignificant amounts of change of any great concern. One 
simply ceases to exist at death - no ability to experience/consider 
anything at all - not something to fear since there is *nothing* there 
that can be experienced to fear. It is no different than the 
non-existence prior to being born. I had not thought of death in this 
manner until discussing it at length with Paul, and now find negative 
for my happiness only the (hopefully temporary) loss of Paul and any 
other individuals of value to me.

> Platt? Philossifur? The
> Extropians? Are their actions based on their changing
> fear of death, perhaps driven by biological changes?

There is far more strangeness to the names missing from the Alcor 
Directory than you - whoever you are??? - have listed.

Directors of Alcor themselves:
Brian Wowk
Saul Kent
Carlos Mondragon
Ralph Merkle
Michael Seidl

Patient Care Trustees:
Warren Robertson
Carlos Mondragon (again)

It seems only reasonable that a requirement for being a Director or a 
Patient Care Trustee is to be signed up and listed in the Directory.

And where is:
Steven B Harris
Aubrey de Grey
Marvin Minsky
Michael West
Peter Toma (Director of International Relations)
Paula Lemler
Natasha Vita-More (alluded to already by original poster)
- and several other members of the Scientific and Medical Advisory 
Boards and other website listed Advisors?
Is it possible that some of these individuals are *not* signed up with 
Alcor? If they are signed up, why would they not not want their names 
included in the Directory? (Many individuals listed only their name and 
town under a state or province, rather than full contactable info.) If 
they are not signed up, then why would Alcor want to have them as listed 
Advisors in any capacity?

And where are almost half of the website listed members of the Alcor staff?

Other significant names not found and thought to be signed up with Alcor 
from public statements made by them:
Michael Darwin
Bill Faloon
Ray Kurzweil
Chris Heward
David D Freidman
Fred & Linda Chamberlain
Max More

Does non-inclusion in the Directory by the immediate above (and there 
are many others) mean that they are *not* signed up or that they don't 
want anyone to know?? This last makes no sense for the Chamberlains, nor 
for those in the list who have spoken at Alcor conferences.

It is possible that I have missed one or more of the above names in the 
paper booklet Directory (I don't see an online version available to 
those with Alcor contracts) although I and Paul both looked. If I have, 
by all means correct me.


> Maybe this is why there are over 2000 Alcor member
> numbers assigned, but less than 1000 current members.
> 
> 
> -unperson
> 


-- 
**Kitty Antonik Wakfer

MoreLife for the rational - http://morelife.org
Reality based tools for more life in quantity and quality
Self-Sovereign Individual Project - http://selfsip.org
Self-sovereignty, rational pursuit of optimal lifetime happiness,
individual responsibility, social preferencing & social contracting

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