X-Message-Number: 30769 Date: Mon, 26 May 2008 05:59:16 -0400 From: "Charles Platt" <> Subject: self interest Now David, surely you will agree that in arguments about self interest, it's all a matter of definition. If I decide to give all my money to my friends before I die, because this will make me feel good about myself and may encourage them to rally around and perform a heroic cryopreservation, I'd say that this is in my self-interest, wouldn't you? Many "charitable" acts benefit the givers. Even when I give to the ACLU, I am hoping to benefit indirectly from their general attempts to protect my rights. You may define altruism as giving without an assurance of benefiting; but if I perceive a strong probability of a benefit, that just as good, for me, as one of those purely capitalistic business deals where I take a risk of losing money instead of making it. Or you may define altruism as an act that benefits both people, not just me; but in my experience, most forms of selfish business acts benefit the consumer as well as the company. Then there is the expectation of future payback. When two dolphins swim beside an injured dolphin to hold it up so that it doesn't drown, they may not be purely altruistic; they may be hoping that if they get injured, they'll get the same assistance. I believe animals make these tradeoffs more frequently than people may imagine. In short, I suggest the only kind of altruistic behavior that is purely altruistic is that which brings the giver no benefit at all, and may even hurt him--which is very rare. Our species has been successful precisely because we maximize our benefits and pleasures. Therefore it should be a surprise only to socialists to find that an altruistic act can be, and often is, also a selfish act. I believe social scientists are mistaken in trying to draw a neat line dividing them from each other. My own past volunteer work for cryonics is a good example. By donating my labor, I hoped to make the cryonics organization stronger, and thus better able to assist me personally. How would you try to disconnect these linkages? Charles Platt Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=30769