X-Message-Number: 32819
From: "John de Rivaz" <>
Subject: Re  [LongevityReport] Nano-nonsense: 25 years of charlatanry
Date: Wed, 1 Sep 2010 22:44:03 +0100


Keith Henson asks for better ideas to assembler nanotechnology for cryonic 
revivals. I think because life itself is based on this technology, it is 
unlikely that anything else will achieve the desired results. Although macro 
based surgery can do wonderful things, it falls far short of repairing living 
systems.  It is like trying to repair a transistor radio using vacuum tubes. 
This is why cancer treatment using surgery, radiation or selective poisons may 
prolong life a bit but cannot alter or repair that fact that a particular 
patient's body is capable of becoming cancerous.


Mark Plus seems to like using his "layman's knowledge of terror management 
theory" to rattle a few cages, but doesn't seem to come up with solutions. His 
campaign to concentrate cryonicists around where he lives is based on global 
warming, volcanic eruptions, fuel shortages and other limits to global commerce.
Has never included any constructive ideas for overseas people to do so within 
the law. This is despite comments from myself and others that maybe this would 
be more useful, or that migration is almost impossible for most people to 
achieve.


But still it is always useful to know what other people are thinking and the 
nano-backlash web sites are certainly interesting from that point of view. It 
may well be that these sites are written by people who have lost money in the 
mini-boom based on start up companies with the word "nano" in their titles.


From the messages created by this cage rattle, I do not believe that assembler 
based nanotechnology is impossible. However I accept that because very few 
people are working on it, it is not going to appear as soon as some people may 
have hoped, or indeed as soon as it would have been physically possible with 
more effort.

-- 
Sincerely, John de Rivaz:  http://John.deRivaz.com for websites including
Cryonics Europe, Longevity Report, The Venturists, Porthtowan, Alec Harley
Reeves - inventor, Arthur Bowker - potter, de Rivaz genealogy,  Nomad .. and
more

Date: Wed, 1 Sep 2010 09:09:11 -0700
Subject: Re: [LongevityReport] "Nano-nonsense: 25 years of charlatanry...
From: Keith Henson <>

On Wed, Sep 1, 2010 at 2:00 AM, MARK PLUS <> wrote:

snip

> I detect fallacious sunk costs reasoning in defense of Drexler's
> speculations. I have no emotional investment in Drexler's reputation,
> and if his ideas suck, we'd do cryonics a disservice by continuing to
> invest our money and hopes in them instead of looking for better
> ideas.

Drexler's work is not easy to understand and harder to implement but
it is based on the best understanding we have of the physical world.
That physical world included our bodies and those stored in LN2.  If
we are going to repair them, we have to gain access to the world of
the very small.

If you have better ideas, don't keep them secret.

Keith



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