X-Message-Number: 33490
From: "Peter Voss" <>
Subject: CryoNet - Fred and Linda and Terasem
Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2011 09:25:03 -0700

Dear Fred & Linda,

I'm glad that my simple reference to Terasem had such a positive effect!

Hope to see you guys soon - and for decades to come...

Best Regards,


From: Fred Chamberlain [mailto:] 
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2011 9:26 AM
To: CryoNet
Cc: ; 'Linda Chamberlain'; 'Martine'
Subject: CryoNet

Re: X-Message-Number: 33476
Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 04:40:55 -0000
Subject: CryoNet to Enter Stasis March 17, 2011
From: "Kevin Q. Brown" <>

>After the March 17, 2011 digest mailing, no more new messages
>will be posted, although the archives still will be accessible
>as a historical record.

>Kevin Q. Brown
>(Please include "cryonics" or "CryoNet" in the subject line.)

Thank you, Kevin, for the 22 years of history of thinking, by
(as you put it) "zombies" as well as others.  We are especially 
indebted to CryoNet for One particular posting and response,
which literally 'changed our lives'.  It took place on the
16th of June, 2009, and is copied in its entirety, below.

X-Message-Number: 31744
From: "Peter Voss" <>
References: <>
Subject: Virtual Immortality
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 11:49:58 -0700

>From: Charles Platt <> : I'm starting to see
>companies that serve (or exploit, as you wish) those of us
>who spend a lot of time in webspace and are aware that
>after death occurs in the physical world, our virtual
>identities may linger in various uncontrolled or unexpected
>ways, or may disappear faster than we would like. Issues
>range from the persistence of a "dead" profile on Facebook
>to the inability of relatives to shut down accounts because
>they lack the necessary passwords. Here's a fair summary of
>some options:

>eternal-space-legacy-locker/  .....

Anyone interested in that may want to look at:
http://www.cyberev.org/ This is run and funded by Martine
Rothblatt who is a great supporter of cryonics. She is
highly committed to making this a permanent and increasingly
comprehensive site. There should be a reasonably simple way to
copy/ backup your other web information to cyberev.org


I was sitting in the passenger area of Sky Harbor Airport at
the time I saw this, browing CryoNet with a pitiful little
HP iPac personal assistant, but it at least allowed me to send
the link to Linda Chamberlain (my 'forever' partner at the firm
she was working), where she immediately had a look at CyBeRev
And the associated links, including the past issues of its
Journals on personal cyberconsciousness and what Terasem terms
"Geoethical Nanotechnology".  By the time I got another break,
a note from Linda indicated that this was the doorway to an
area of activity we would have never suspected existed, except
for the posting by Charles Platt and Peter Voss's reply.

Why would we notice and take what was said by these two people
seriously?  We had great respect for them both, as it turned
out.  Charles Platt's novel "Silicon Man" was one of the first
(and still the best) stories about cyberconsciousness we had
ever seen; we'd had the pleasure of meeting him in New York
years before and spending time with him walking about Central
Park and elsewhere, after which he became very, very active in
cryonics and has since contributed a great deal to its growth
and development, including (at present) his participation in
the development of Mike Darwin's new blog, "Chronosphere".  Our
past connections with Peter Voss went deeper still.  During
our years of working with Alcor, in one never-to-be-forgotten
standby and suspension, we (Fred & Linda), along with Peter and
his partner, Evelyn, flew to Chicago, drove the standby/transport
equipment to the middle of Ohio, negotiated patient access with
a stubbornly resistant Catholic Hospital, carried out transport
and washout, flew back to Phoenix, and helped with the rest of
the operation (cryoprotection and start of cooldown).  That was
memorable if for no other reason essentially going without
sleep for around eighty hours.  One of those few opportunities
to do something we will always remember (if cryonics and other
pursuits of life extension permit), virtually 'forever'.

In any case, this 'on the fly' introduction to Terasem led to
our being able to participate in one of the workshop/colloquia
that Terasem held in Second Life in December, 1969, by way
of a talk titled  "Empowerment of Cybertwins as  Trustees, Surrogates
for Reanimation Decision Making, and Guardians of Cryonauts,
Prior to Personality Interface Implementation by Mutual Consent"
(online access at http://www.lifepact.com/cybertwins.htm with
links to a video at http://vimeo.com/10001382 where the Power
Point slides are blended with the audio of the talk.  Two days
after the presentation in Second Life on Terasem Island, we
flew to Melbourne, Florida and on December 12, 2009 purchased
the mobile home where we now live, met Martine Rothblatt for
the first time 'in person' at noon, at the Terasem Ashram in
Melbourne Beach, and the following June (2010) moved into that
mobile home, where we are now deeply involved with Terasem and
what it is becoming.  Based on that, we think it's a fair thing
to say that one posting on CryoNet literally 'changed our lives'
in ways that could scarcely have happened as they did, without
that interchange (between Charles Platt and Peter Voss).

So, it's with all of that in mind that, Keven, we thank you for
what just one posting on Cryonet did for the two of us, and
for all of the other historical interchanges that will now lie
there in wait for any who wish to explore them, perhaps to meet
those who without that they would never have known, and even
perhaps to find that doing so 'changed their lives' in ways that
cannot even begin to be imagined, at this time.

Boundless Life,

Fred & Linda Chamberlain


-----Original Message-----
From:  [mailto:]
On Behalf Of CryoNet
Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2011 2:00 AM
Subject: CryoNet #33477 - #33481

CryoNet - Tue 15 Mar 2011

    #33477: Please don't kill CryoNet [Eivind Berge]
    #33478: New Cryonet Yahoo Group formed [John de Rivaz]
    #33479: Re: CryoNet to Enter Stasis March 17, 2011 [Keith Henson]
    #33480: Re: CryoNet stasis [Stephen Bridge]
    #33481: Behind the scenes suppression of free speech? [Finance

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Message #33477
Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 11:11:36 +0100
Subject: Please don't kill CryoNet
From: Eivind Berge <>

Kevin Q. Brown announced in Message #33476 that CryoNet will end on March
17, 2011. I want to say this is a very sad decision and I exhort him to
change his mind. Since 1996, CryoNet has been a daily fixture in my life,
and no other cryonics forum comes close for news and discussion on the
topic. In my opinion, the quality of postings is almost as good now as when
I first joined. Yes, there is also garbage, but not the "zombie hordes" of
trolls and spammers that would justify shutting the whole thing down. I
think the rating system works pretty well, too, though it has been abused on
occasion. Indeed everything works surprisingly well, given how open it is.
And the cryonics community needs a place for us to come together openly.

The beauty of CryoNet is its simplicity. No creeping featurism here, which
has degraded so many services. Just plain text by email which also remains
immutably in the archives, easily referenced. CryoNet does not need a major
reboot, in my opinion, and it certainly does not deserve to die. Just leave
it alone, please.

Eivind Berge

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Message #33478
From: "John de Rivaz" <>
Subject: New Cryonet Yahoo Group formed
Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 10:58:16 -0000

I have formed a Yahoo Group called New Cryonet. Those who are disappointed
with the closure of the CryoNet mailing list can use this. Abusive posters,
spammers etc., will be put on moderation, but otherwise anyone is free to
join and anyone may post.


To start with I will be "dictator", but if the group attracts a lot of
members and is popular, then there can be other moderators. Hopefully
everyone will behave and there will be no need for anyone to be "on
moderation" :-)

The advantage of Yahoo Groups is that people can use them on the web or as
an email list. If you don't want lots of individual emails, you can set your
membership to "digest" and it will work exactly like CryoNet.  

You can post your message by sending to

It is best to join the group via the web, but you can also subscribe by
sending an email to 

If someone else forms another email list that is more popular, then this one
could be closed down to avoid fragmentation. There are, of course, already
web based forums, but you have to go to the web page every time to view them
which some people prefer not to have to do. You can, in fact use "New
CryoNet" like a web list if you really wanted to, by setting your membership
to "no email" and just reading on the web.

Sincerely, John de Rivaz:  http://John.deRivaz.com for websites including
Cryonics Europe, Longevity Report, The Venturists, Porthtowan, Alec Harley
Reeves - inventor, Arthur Bowker - potter, de Rivaz genealogy,  Nomad .. and

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Message #33479
Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 11:01:24 -0700
Subject: Re: CryoNet to Enter Stasis March 17, 2011
From: Keith Henson <>

On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 2:00 AM, "Kevin Q. Brown" <>


> After the March 17, 2011 digest mailing, no more new messages will be 
> posted, although the archives still will be accessible as a historical 
> record.

Sigh.  It's your mailing list.

> Fortunately, unlike 1988, cryonics and related topics now are covered 
> very well in many other places on the Internet.
> Please visit and nourish them. And avoid the zombie hordes.

What do you recommend?

I have no idea of what is out there that's any good.  The ones I have looked
at I have not liked at all.

Best wishes,


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Message #33480
References: <>
Subject: Re: CryoNet stasis
From: Stephen Bridge <>
Date: Mon, 14 Mar 2011 22:03:54 -0400 (EDT)


Kevin, 22 years of anything is good.  22 years of dealing with a contentious
bunch of cryonicists is bravery beyond the strength of most people.  I
admire you for starting CryoNet and for putting up with everyone for this
long.  You've done us all more good than you'll ever be thanked for.  Thank
you.  Your break is well-earned.  

Steve Bridge


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Message #33481
Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2011 01:51:56 -0500
Subject: Behind the scenes suppression of free speech?
From: Finance Department <>


I find it curious that within weeks of the Cold Filter owner beginning to
moderate so heavily that entire posts from some veteran members are deleted,
causing some such to cease bothering to post there and the forum to become a
bowl of infrequent pablum messages, now the CryoNet owner is also
mysteriously moved to put his forum into "stasis".

And what are we offered so far as a replacement?  An advertisement-laden
Yahoo Group where dictatorial moderation is promised (Definition of
moderation:  The censorship of material the dictator or a clique of same,
personally disagrees with).

It almost makes one wonder who is behind this recent disabling of what once
were free speech vehicles for cryonics and related discussion.  And what the
incentives or disincentives were for complying with the orders for shutdown
or heavy moderation.

And now Stephen Bridge, Alcor's emergency Spin Doctor, who rarely is allowed
by his work and family to post at all, has emerged as well, in defense of
CryoNet going away.

Oh OK, given the possibility there was no such outside influence, then the
blame rests squarely on the shoulders of the forum owners, acting
irresponsibly to deter/disallow free speech.  I, though, smell a rat in the

And I respectfully request Kevin Brown the CN owner, if he carries out his
death (stasis) threat, to reanimate the forum thereafter as soon as
possible, after a brief period of personal reflection on the implications of
his action of removing the only remaining free speech vehicle for cryonics
discussion from the internet.

Not so cheerful,



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