X-Message-Number: 5383
Date: Sat, 9 Dec 1995 13:24:13 -0800 (PST)
From: "Kevin Q. Brown" <>
Subject: Re: Non-Digest Version Available?
In Message #5378, Guy Gipson <> said:
> I noted with some interest that the latest Cryonet digest burst included
> message number 5371 from B. Wowk, which was a direct response to number
> 5370, also in the same digest, from D. Cosenza. . . .
> If the listadmin or anyone might post the procedure for obtaining Cryonet
> messages individually rather than by digest, I know I would prefer it,
> and probably some others would as well. Thanks.
Guy,
That's an interesting question because it shows that some things need
to be explained about how CryoNet works. I have both a short answer
and a long answer for you. The short answer is that messages 5370 and
5371 were forwarded from the USENET sci.cryonics news group, not from
a "reflector-mode" version of the CryoNet mailing list. The long answer
concerns the details of running multiple mailing lists and, especially,
the way that messages are forwarded between CryoNet and sci.cryonics.
I (or someone else) could create an additional, "reflector-mode" mailing
list that distributes messages as they arrive rather than issuing a
digest once a day. (See Messages 4365, 4847, and the messages they cite
for more ideas on CryoNet alternatives.) At c2.org (the host machine
for cryonet.org) the cost structure has changed, mostly to my advantage,
since those previous messages. Now each telnet-only shell account costs
only $7.50/month and can have its own Majordomo-powered mailing list at
no extra charge. (The options for handling a domain, such as cryonet.org,
cost extra.) Since a second shell account should not be needed for the
second mailing list, maybe a better price can be negotiated. (I think
that with procmail and a little programming, the domain "cryonet.org"
could be used for the second list, too.) I can imagine several possible
implementations and prices. Each will cost a few dollars a month,
some of my programming time to set up, some continuous administrative
overhead, and a little thought on how to coordinate automatically the
messages of the two lists. I'm too busy to do all that right now,
but perhaps (with some financial incentive) a reflector-mode version
of CryoNet would be achievable early in 1996.
Probably several people do not know how forwarding between the CryoNet
mailing list and the USENET sci.cryonics news group works. Before
describing that, though, I need to point out an important difference
between their charters:
The USENET sci.cryonics news group was created for discussing
(strictly) scientific/technical cryonics-related topics, whereas
CryoNet is for anything that relates somehow to cryonics. Since
cryonics involves a lot of socio-political issues in addition to
the technical issues, the CryoNet mailing list typically sees a
wider range of topics than sci.cryonics.
Here is how the forwarding is done between CryoNet and sci.cryonics:
CryoNet -> sci.cryonics
The CryoNet software automatically forwards a message from CryoNet to
sci.cryonics when the author of the message includes "SCI.CRYONICS"
(in upper case) within the subject line of the message. For this to
work well:
(1) people posting to CryoNet need to remember to include "SCI.CRYONICS"
in the subject line when posting a message that is also appropriate
for sci.cryonics, and
(2) people posting to CryoNet need the self-control to _not_ include
"SCI.CRYONICS" in the subject line when posting a message that is
_not_ appropriate for sci.cryonics.
There is some subtlety to this. For example, messages that have been
forwarded from sci.cryonics to a CryoNet digest (as described below)
will include the line "Newsgroups: sci.cryonics" in their header, next
to the "From:" and "Subject:" lines. If you want your reply to such a
message to be seen by its author, you should either include "SCI.CRYONICS"
in your subject line or email your reply both to him/her and CryoNet.
sci.cryonics -> CryoNet
There is no automatic mechanism set up for this; it's always done manually
and anyone can do it. So far, though, I am the only person who has done it.
Why is that?
First, we do not _want_ all the sci.cryonics messages to go to CryoNet.
Not even all the "good" ones. For example, once a month the nine-part
60 KByte sci.cryonics FAQ gets posted automatically to sci.cryonics.
Forwarding it to CryoNet each time would be a mistake because it's so big.
Instead, it is in the CryoNet archives (messages 0018.1 through 0018.9)
so that anyone can retrieve it whenever he/she wants. Also, several
long-winded and marginally interesting sci.cryonics threads never get
forwarded to CryoNet and that's a good thing, too. USENET news groups
can tolerate large quantities of redundant and high-noise-to-signal-ratio
messages a lot better than a mailing list because they go to a shared
news area at each site rather than to each person's private mailbox.
Anyone can forward a USENET sci.cryonics message to CryoNet; just mail
it to I do it somewhat differently, though.
To prevent a digest from showing _me_ as the author of a forwarded
message, I email it to "" and insert a "FORWARD"
designation so that the CryoNet software strips my email headers from
the forwarded message, leaving only the USENET poster as the author.
(Currently the software lets only me use that "FORWARD" capability,
though. Perhaps it should let others do it, too?)
This system of forwarding from sci.cryonics to CryoNet obviously has flaws.
It's labor intensive. Sometimes I don't forward messages that probably
should have gone to CryoNet (because I was on vacation or was too busy,
or the message never arrived at my USENET news machine, or I was being
evil and biased). Probably sometimes people wish that I didn't forward the
messages I did. Suggestions for a better forwarding mechanism are welcome.
Kevin Q. Brown
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