X-Message-Number: 9867 Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 01:47:10 -0400 From: "Stephen W. Bridge" <> Subject: In-house LN2 production To CryoNet From Steve Bridge, Alcor Foundation June 6, 1998 In reply to: Message #9836 From: "den Otter" <> Subject: Liquid nitrogen plants & some other ideas Date: Mon, 1 Jun 1998 16:56:03 +0200 Thanks to Paul Wakfer (#9845) for the explanation (clearer than the one I was preparing) about in-house LN2 production and why it is not a major consideration for cryonics companies today. To add a couple of other points: Right now none of the cryonics companies are dependent on only one source of LN2. Phoenix has at least two production plants, with more expensive (because of distance) emergency capability in Southern California and Las Vegas. I believe the other storage facilities (being located near major urban areas) have a similar situation. Not only would it be more expensive than it would be worth to purchase a LN2 machine at this time, one must also allocate room for it. And I doubt if any of us have looked at what kinds of regulation and licensing such a manufacturing device might entail. Maybe none, but I doubt it. "den Otter" also says "A facility like this could easily be made so that it's safe from natural disasters." I'm surprised Paul didn't jump on that one more quickly. Perhaps it depends on one's definition of "easy;" but I think it is one hell of a lot of *work* to build such a building, not to mention expensive. Paperwork alone can drive you crazy. Also, "den Otter" and others seem to have the idea that buildings as far away from civilization as possible must be the best place for patient storage. Personally, I don't see it that way. Yes, you don't want your building in the center of the highest crime area of a city; but there are plenty of relatively safe suburban areas near large cities. Cryonics in general is a high tech enterprise, and becoming more so every year. We need access to the kinds of technology available in large cities with hospitals, medical research, science libraries, and tech engineers of all kinds if we are to IMPROVE cryonics. Yes, you could move into a missile base on the edge of nowhere if what you wanted was complete isolation and only wanted to store patients. But cryonics is also about getting patients into suspension and getting them out again. We are not the Egyptians storing mummies. We also need access to major airports and highways for transportation so we can GET to our members. Besides, those missible silos are stripped, even of the wiring in the walls, and often full of water (Alcor people have looked at two of them over the years). It would be incredibly expensive to make them functional for patient storage. Not simple; not cheap. Once we are large enough that we could afford to place the more passive part of the cryonics operation (patient storage) at a location remote from the emergency, administrative, and research parts we might consider some of these scenarios again. Right now, though, it is more efficient to keep the entire operation in one or two nearby locations. Steve Bridge Rate This Message: http://www.cryonet.org/cgi-bin/rate.cgi?msg=9867